Saturday, September 16, 2006

Pentecostal discussions about Poverty

Shane Clifton over at Pentecostal Discussions has been writing a series on poverty and the church: After detailing issues on Global Poverty and Extreme Poverty he raises the important question: Why has the church ignored the poor?

‘Perhaps the main reason’, he sums up, is that ‘we have misread the message of the gospel of Jesus, and failed to follow His model and pursue His mission’. He will later look at the most important question of all: ‘how can we help the poor?’.

Speaking as one who has spent most of his Christian life within the evangelical wings of the Charismatic and Pentecostal worlds, it is all the more refreshing to know of those within this proud tradition who are wrestling with the same questions that get me animated - and concerned.

Update: I have just read this quote, and I felt it appropriate to bung here.
‘Christian talk of God or human life may never by-pass suffering since to do so is to by-pass the crucified God’ (Richard Bauckham, in his preface to the 2001 SCM edition of Moltmann’s The Crucified God)


At 9/16/2006 4:15 AM, Anonymous One of Freedom said...

I know I also really appreciate what Shane and company are doing on that blog. Something for those of us from the Pentecostal/Charismatic worlds to actually be proud of. Kinda like we are finally growing up.

At 9/17/2006 12:08 PM, Anonymous tigger said...

Hi Chris,

I read a quote of Wimber on another blog which went something like, 'Never trust a leader who doesn't have a limp'.

Over the years I've been trying to find that middleground between overly triumphalistic restorationalism/charismaticism and depressing 'strict baptist' cynicism.

I find that the concept of triumph through suffering is the only way to defuse triumphalism of its arrogance and cynicism of its despair.

Indeed, the return within such movements to the more 'Orthodox' tradition of hope-through-suffering (which is par excellence what the Crucifixion-Resurrection complex is about) is a breath of fresh air!


btw Was hat Anja gedacht mit meinem Deustchen vlog?

At 9/17/2006 1:15 PM, Anonymous Shane Clifton said...

Hey Chris - thanks for visiting our blog again. My biggest challenge on pentecostal discussions is getting things up on a regular basis - I really dont know how you keep it up.

Anyway - the current series on poverty has been a personal challenge - it is one thing to identity a problem, another altogether to consider how best to respond.

At 9/17/2006 1:47 PM, Anonymous Thomas Powell said...

This dialogue must be had. Delusions of triumphalist grandeur and the seductions of the name-it-claim-it have distracted us from Christ's heart and are pride-based sins. I think these issues are creeping back onto the radar of the entire spectrum of charismatics and evangelicals. I'm glad to see it discussed in the halls of higher learning, I pray that those who have studied under him will be able to incorporate these views into their overall theology - it seems to take an amazing amount of energy and time to get something from the seminary to the pew!

At 9/18/2006 11:31 AM, Anonymous byron smith said...

I found this post on poverty an interesting addition.

At 9/19/2006 1:28 AM, Anonymous Chris Tilling said...

Hi Frank,
Yes, know what you mean. That's one of the things I appreciated about Jason's Vineyard - practical love for the less well off people in our community. A small start, but a start.

Hi Tigger,
Anja was quite impressed with your effort, especially with some of you phrases.

Hi Shane,
Well, I didn't keep it up very well over the last few days!

Thanks for your comments, Thomas. As for this getting gto th epew, amen to that.

Thanks for the link, Byron


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