Unbelievable?
No, not silly nonsense such as people who dare to disagree with me, who bother to read Jim West's blog without laughing derisively, or those who claim to converse with the alien 'mother ship', who use Domestos as a breath freshener, or who turn their underpants inside out to double their pre-washing machine life-span etc.
Rather, these Premier Christian Radio programmes, ably hosted by Justin Brierley, are worth a listen. They discuss the expected mix of subjects in a respectful way, and the listener 'phone ins' and e-mails are most revealing in that they show were some pew-level evangelical thinking is at. I needed to be reminded of the evangelical world beyond the world of blogdom and Tübingen. A sobering wakeup call.
posted by Chris Tilling @ 3:40 PM
9 comments
9 Comments:
mentioned in the same breath as mother ship? i'm wounded...
Turning underpants inside out to double pre-washing life span - they were the days. How I miss college!
It is interesting that you make this point 'Ricky', " they show were some pew-level evangelical thinking is at. I needed to be reminded of the evangelical world beyond the world of blogdom and Tübingen. A sobering wakeup call". If I have one critique of the biblio/theo blog world it is that it seems to forget what Parish ministry is like. There appears to be little theological reflection or engagement from those who are in the pulpit week after week (and the myriad of other tasks we undertake). Likewise, I am often left thinking that some of the bloggers need to get out into a church and 'test' some of their theology and see it in action (this doesn't apply to you of course Chris). On the other hand, my critique of 'us' ministers is that we often do not engage enough with theology and biblical studies (in an academic sense). Barth argued continually that theology belonged in the church. It seems however that the gulf between theology and the church is growing wider and wider (at least here in Australia - bunch of convicts we are - except for those of us from South Australia who are proudly the one 'free' state ;-) ), Anyway thanks for the link. I had better go and do something; I think I will take up an offering!
Mark.
Maybe I'm missing the point of the post, but I don't get what's so shocking about the pew-level theology of these programs and discussions. Why is it surprising that these are the questions people are asking, and the topics that they need more assurance in? I didn't listen to all of them but to me they seem rather good because they are answering the questions of the people asking them and doing so in a manner that piques their interest and also calms some of their fears. Don't forget, these people have neither dedicated their life to research nor have any intention to do so. The majority who listen are simply trying to live as much in accord with Jesus' message as they can, and there's nothing wrong with that.
As I think about this more, even your most passionate non-professional believers are never going to read more than a few of C.S. Lewis and N.T. Wright's popular works, one or two pop-theoloogy books and a chapter or two out of their Bible a day. They are far too busy being medical doctors, teaching physics or working on the assembly line at the local factory. They fear whether or not Christ actually rose from the dead and are assured when Wright or Lewis or the guy on "Unbelievable?" this week say that they believe he truly did, because they know that they don't have the time to do the research on their own but have to trust in those who do. So no, they don't get into the heated debates over the meaning or terminology of a passage and most have never even heard the terms inerrancy, eschatology, metanarrative or (choose your term), but that's okay. Like I said before, they are simply trying to interpret Jesus' message from the information that they have available to them in their busy lives and are trying to love God and others.
To be honest, I'm rather envious of that type of faith at times, and think it is probably closer to the "faith like a child" than my faith.
Oh JB, that is quite a link! Definite blogging potential!
Hey Mark, thanks for your comment.
"Likewise, I am often left thinking that some of the bloggers need to get out into a church and 'test' some of their theology and see it in action (this doesn't apply to you of course Chris). "
I have that creeping feeling it may well apply to me!
Hi Ranger,
I think you may have misunderstood my post. When you write " don't get what's so shocking about the pew-level theology of these programs and discussions", this is precisely what I meant: I am shoked I had forgotten where people are at. I didn't mean to sound superior or judgmental. Or did I misunderstand you?
Hey Chris,
I'm sorry. I apparently did misunderstand you. The first paragraph threw me off, and I was thinking you were saying that their discussions and questions were as unbelievable as the stuff listed in the first paragraph, and you were thus being sarcastic in the second paragraph when you said Brierley "ably" hosted them and that they were "worth a listen." After re-reading the post I realize that I was way off. Sorry!
This is why I truly respect the theologians take difficult topics and make them accessible to the masses in the pews. One such book that really inspired me was "The Meaning of Jesus: Two Visions" by N.T. Wright and Marcus Borg. I was in college when I stumbled across it I knew so very little about theology (I was a young earth creationist who was fairly confident that the rapture would happen in my lifetime). It totally opened my eyes to a much larger church and to a much larger vision of who Jesus is and what His message is for us today (particularly through Wright's sections). The reason I loved the book at the time and didn't write it off was simply because it was accessible and readable.
This conversation reminds my why John Stott is a hero of mine - he's managed to keep his feet in the church and still be a solid scholar - too many seem to be either or folks - we need more pastor/scholars like John Stott in the church.
Hi Ranger,
" The reason I loved the book at the time and didn't write it off was simply because it was accessible and readable."
Yes, I know what you mean about Wright on that front!
Coming to this topic a little late and recognising that some of Ranger's comments were responding to something s/he misunderstood, I'd still like to comment.
One of the things I notice about Evangelical churches a la Sydney Anglicans is that most of the people in their pews have heard the term "inerrancy". They can tell you that Scripture in its original version is inerrant and know that people who don't believe this are wrong. They think it is an important concept and they really care about it.
Depending on where you are ministering, you may find that there are lots of people in your pews who understand the term "metanarrative" because they've learned it in their studies of literature. We tend to forget, I think, that many of the methods currently being employed in Biblical studies are also being employed in secular studies of literature and language. I go walking with two friends once a week. One teaches teaching English as a second language and the other teaches linguistics. Neither are active church members. We often find that each of us can provide helpful insights into the work of the others. We can certainly follow quite complex issues in the others' fields.
While the people in our pews may well not be going to read biblical/theological scholarship, at least those who have studied beyond high school are quite likely to be able to follow when their clergy talk about it - especially in the context of a Bible study group which provides time to explain things in depth and answer questions.
It is my personal opinion that the ever-widening gap that Mark (emergent pilgrim) describes has been created at least partly by clergy who either underestimate the capacity for lay people to understand or understand it so poorly themselves that they're afraid to try to communicate it. Of course, many clergy are so busy doing other things around the church that they don't have time to read and discuss current theological issues, which doesn't help
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